Suggestion for announcements
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Hi to all & apologies for this post length plus I think I may be the one causing the trouble & confusion over in the other thread Text to Speech function questions
@Con-Hennekens said in Text to Speech function questions:
I agree however that the current method takes some knowledge about it in advance.
I am glad we can agree that the current system is a little confusing without the extra special knowledge
This confusion or requirement to know the extra knowledge is why I believe the announcement function cannot stay the same,
it needs to be cleaned up so it is easier for all to understand@Con-Hennekens said in Text to Speech function questions:
I think your suggestion would make things even more complicated. I think there would be a more simple method possible.
but here we disagree, I think my suggestion is the simple method
It is a simple 4 stage progression switch
- Off - no announcements
- Notes- announce only the notes field
- Via - announce the Via hard points names + the notes field
- All - announce everything, it means All = all of the soft point names, all the Via hard point names & all the notes, no hidden numerical filters
So setting 1 "Off" is obviously for those who like silence & don't care for announcements
You can still add info in the Notes field & select "Off" but nothing would be announced,
information in the notes field would still show on the screen layout if you had "Upcoming Waypoint" selected as would the point name but you would hear nothingSetting 2 "Notes" means the user can selectively choose which points get a announced by simply adding text to the Notes field of that point
There is no need for check boxes to say announce this point, the simple addition of text to the Notes field acts like the check box
If you have nothing in the Notes field you hear nothing,
If you add a note you hear it but you would not hear the "unnecessary pointless" address information in the point name field
I think most users would choose this setting as it allows them to control when & what they want to hearSetting 3 "Via" is similar to the current setup, you would hear an announcement of the hard point names plus any additional note information
If you only want to hear the hard point names announced you don't add additional text in the notes field& setting 4 "All" is everything for those who like an overdose of information,
don't choose All if you don't want the to hear all the address name stored in the point name field
All means as above = everything, it is unfiltered you hear all the point names & all the notesIMO this is the simplest system & gives the user the most flexibility in MRA Navigation & is more compatible with other navigation systems
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@Con-Hennekens said in Suggestion for announcements:.- Maybe the name field ...... made unchangeable
Please no no no, the point name field is the standard common field to show additional user editable information with other systems
I would go for this option: Via - announce the Via hard points names + the notes field
I can't make it any simpler
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@RetiredWingMan Absolutely agree with you on this. I always change the name of a waypoint when it is something important to me. Would love to see it not change the name when moved.
Would appreciate it though if the note part could hold more characters than it does currently. And yes, notes should also be spoken.
@Inge-Bakermans said in Suggestion for announcements:
@RetiredWingMan Absolutely agree with you on this. I always change the name of a waypoint when it is something important to me. Would love to see it not change the name when moved.
Would appreciate it though if the note part could hold more characters than it does currently. And yes, notes should also be spoken.
I have also some concerns with the complexity of WP, with digit, no digit in the name for a SP.
But not to get a new name for a necessary move is so easy. When the WP is moved and you got the confirmation screen do not press „Accept“, press „Cancel“. The movement will be done and the name and Infos text is carried over unchanged.May it is in the „Handbook“. For me it was also an Info which I read here in the Forum.
Peter
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@Inge-Bakermans said in Suggestion for announcements:
@RetiredWingMan Absolutely agree with you on this. I always change the name of a waypoint when it is something important to me. Would love to see it not change the name when moved.
Would appreciate it though if the note part could hold more characters than it does currently. And yes, notes should also be spoken.
I have also some concerns with the complexity of WP, with digit, no digit in the name for a SP.
But not to get a new name for a necessary move is so easy. When the WP is moved and you got the confirmation screen do not press „Accept“, press „Cancel“. The movement will be done and the name and Infos text is carried over unchanged.May it is in the „Handbook“. For me it was also an Info which I read here in the Forum.
@Peter-Schiefer interesting. There must be an option to confirm wp moves because I don't get a confirmation message block.
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For both things you mention, you can use a via point. I always make sure that there is a gas station in the route after x number of KM. So that I can fill up there, usually between 180 and 250 KM.
I also use a via point for unpaved roads, just as a warning.
And that can all be planned
@Hans-van-de-Ven-MR-MRA said in Suggestion for announcements:
I also use a via point for unpaved roads, just as a warning.
I would certainly not want to do this! In the unlucky situation where this 'announcement via point' must be autoskipped, it cannot and requires manual interaction. Having the ability to get the information from a shaping point is crucial to me. I want to use via only for explicit at via usage: that is, a place that MUST be visited.
Manks bu'j te bange.
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@Hans-van-de-Ven-MR-MRA said in Suggestion for announcements:
I also use a via point for unpaved roads, just as a warning.
I would certainly not want to do this! In the unlucky situation where this 'announcement via point' must be autoskipped, it cannot and requires manual interaction. Having the ability to get the information from a shaping point is crucial to me. I want to use via only for explicit at via usage: that is, a place that MUST be visited.
@Stefan-Hummelink said in Suggestion for announcements:
@Hans-van-de-Ven-MR-MRA said in Suggestion for announcements:
I also use a via point for unpaved roads, just as a warning.
I would certainly not want to so this! In the unlucky situation where this 'announcement via point' must be autoskipped, it cannot and requires manual interaction. Having the ability to get the information from a shaping point is crucial to me. I want to use via only for explicit at via usage: that is, a place that MUST be visited.
As I mentioned now few times, the handling with shaping and Viapoints the differences in announcements by inputs with digits or no digits and distance is confusing. It is a cause of errors at the planning phase and need too much attention.
Actually the reliability is worth.My idea now is if a SP is used as important set a „blind“ VP short behind this SP so it will not skipped by calculation or a recalculation by new circumstances.
Garmin, i can only repeat is for me the master. Only VP (Wp with Alarm) are those with announcement,
And by the why, what you now called up is for me a point wher all the good things of MRA with taking information to WPs like text and pictures contains conflict in it self.
If SP with such Infos can be skipped automatically and I am on a new route not considered that a SP is or will be passed, this can not be a requirement.Peter
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@Con-Hennekens I like being able to change the name of the waypoint. That way i can easily tell what the waypoint is when looking at the list of waypoints. I would prefer that a waypoint name that has been manually entered not be changed it I move the waypoint. I don't have any issues with the current announcement methodology other than when waypoints "interfere" with each other causing missed announcements.
@RetiredWingMan said in Suggestion for announcements:
I like being able to change the name of the waypoint. That way i can easily tell what the waypoint is when looking at the list of waypoints. I would prefer that a waypoint name that has been manually entered not be changed it I move the waypoint.
That is a great addition, thanks!
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Just leave it as it is, only be able to lock the name if it is a via point, so that it is not changed when moving. If you put it down correctly right away, you don't have to move it anymore.
As @RetiredWingMan indicates, it is very useful to see in the list of waypoints what kind of point it is.
Garmin navigation systems also use this Tag: <name></name> to announce hard (via) points.
I would then choose to only announce the via points together with the note, because that is a requirement for a route that is in the RouteXpert library.
Why would you want to announce a formation point?@Hans-van-de-Ven-MR-MRA said in Suggestion for announcements:
Why would you want to announce a formation point?
Why would you want to limit announcements to VIA points? VIA points are solely intended to be mandatory, no other features should be hung up on being VIA points.
I am just an enthusiastic MRA user, and hope you will be one too!
Most motorcycle problems are caused by the nut that connects the handlebar to the saddle.
Streetpilot 2610/Zumo 660/Zumo 395/ CAT S52 + MRA app -
Hi to all & apologies for this post length plus I think I may be the one causing the trouble & confusion over in the other thread Text to Speech function questions
@Con-Hennekens said in Text to Speech function questions:
I agree however that the current method takes some knowledge about it in advance.
I am glad we can agree that the current system is a little confusing without the extra special knowledge
This confusion or requirement to know the extra knowledge is why I believe the announcement function cannot stay the same,
it needs to be cleaned up so it is easier for all to understand@Con-Hennekens said in Text to Speech function questions:
I think your suggestion would make things even more complicated. I think there would be a more simple method possible.
but here we disagree, I think my suggestion is the simple method
It is a simple 4 stage progression switch
- Off - no announcements
- Notes- announce only the notes field
- Via - announce the Via hard points names + the notes field
- All - announce everything, it means All = all of the soft point names, all the Via hard point names & all the notes, no hidden numerical filters
So setting 1 "Off" is obviously for those who like silence & don't care for announcements
You can still add info in the Notes field & select "Off" but nothing would be announced,
information in the notes field would still show on the screen layout if you had "Upcoming Waypoint" selected as would the point name but you would hear nothingSetting 2 "Notes" means the user can selectively choose which points get a announced by simply adding text to the Notes field of that point
There is no need for check boxes to say announce this point, the simple addition of text to the Notes field acts like the check box
If you have nothing in the Notes field you hear nothing,
If you add a note you hear it but you would not hear the "unnecessary pointless" address information in the point name field
I think most users would choose this setting as it allows them to control when & what they want to hearSetting 3 "Via" is similar to the current setup, you would hear an announcement of the hard point names plus any additional note information
If you only want to hear the hard point names announced you don't add additional text in the notes field& setting 4 "All" is everything for those who like an overdose of information,
don't choose All if you don't want the to hear all the address name stored in the point name field
All means as above = everything, it is unfiltered you hear all the point names & all the notesIMO this is the simplest system & gives the user the most flexibility in MRA Navigation & is more compatible with other navigation systems
&
@Con-Hennekens said in Suggestion for announcements:.- Maybe the name field ...... made unchangeable
Please no no no, the point name field is the standard common field to show additional user editable information with other systems
@Brian-McG said in Suggestion for announcements:
@Con-Hennekens said in Suggestion for announcements:.
Maybe the name field ...... made unchangeablePlease no no no, the point name field is the standard common field to show additional user editable information with other systems
Point taken, I agree with this, and changed my OT accordingly.
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@Stefan-Hummelink said in Suggestion for announcements:
@Hans-van-de-Ven-MR-MRA said in Suggestion for announcements:
I also use a via point for unpaved roads, just as a warning.
I would certainly not want to so this! In the unlucky situation where this 'announcement via point' must be autoskipped, it cannot and requires manual interaction. Having the ability to get the information from a shaping point is crucial to me. I want to use via only for explicit at via usage: that is, a place that MUST be visited.
As I mentioned now few times, the handling with shaping and Viapoints the differences in announcements by inputs with digits or no digits and distance is confusing. It is a cause of errors at the planning phase and need too much attention.
Actually the reliability is worth.My idea now is if a SP is used as important set a „blind“ VP short behind this SP so it will not skipped by calculation or a recalculation by new circumstances.
Garmin, i can only repeat is for me the master. Only VP (Wp with Alarm) are those with announcement,
And by the why, what you now called up is for me a point wher all the good things of MRA with taking information to WPs like text and pictures contains conflict in it self.
If SP with such Infos can be skipped automatically and I am on a new route not considered that a SP is or will be passed, this can not be a requirement.@Peter-Schiefer said in Suggestion for announcements:
My idea now is if a SP is used as important set a „blind“ VP short behind this SP so it will not skipped by calculation or a recalculation by new circumstances.
That is really unnecessary if no features are interfering with the sole purpose of a VIA point: make it mandatory...
I am just an enthusiastic MRA user, and hope you will be one too!
Most motorcycle problems are caused by the nut that connects the handlebar to the saddle.
Streetpilot 2610/Zumo 660/Zumo 395/ CAT S52 + MRA app -
@Peter-Schiefer said in Suggestion for announcements:
My idea now is if a SP is used as important set a „blind“ VP short behind this SP so it will not skipped by calculation or a recalculation by new circumstances.
That is really unnecessary if no features are interfering with the sole purpose of a VIA point: make it mandatory...
@Con-Hennekens said in Suggestion for announcements:
@Peter-Schiefer said in Suggestion for announcements:
My idea now is if a SP is used as important set a „blind“ VP short behind this SP so it will not skipped by calculation or a recalculation by new circumstances.
That is really unnecessary if no features are interfering with the sole purpose of a VIA point: make it mandatory...
I assume that some are so convinced with MRA that they do not hear the concerns.
My finding with no doubts is that the realibilty of announcements get worse since 4.3 by whatever reason.
If there is an annother verbal notice like route advice within the 2 kilometers or just before there is no verbal hint. In a lucky situation yoy got the info Waypoint reached but this also coud be ignored.Peter
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@Con-Hennekens said in Suggestion for announcements:
@Peter-Schiefer said in Suggestion for announcements:
My idea now is if a SP is used as important set a „blind“ VP short behind this SP so it will not skipped by calculation or a recalculation by new circumstances.
That is really unnecessary if no features are interfering with the sole purpose of a VIA point: make it mandatory...
I assume that some are so convinced with MRA that they do not hear the concerns.
My finding with no doubts is that the realibilty of announcements get worse since 4.3 by whatever reason.
If there is an annother verbal notice like route advice within the 2 kilometers or just before there is no verbal hint. In a lucky situation yoy got the info Waypoint reached but this also coud be ignored.@Peter-Schiefer said in Suggestion for announcements:
I assume that some are so convinced with MRA that they do not hear the concerns.
If I was so "convinced with MRA", I would not have made the suggestion I made above... I assume that some are so convinced of their own methods and opinions that they think the rest of the world should change those accordingly?
I think the comment I made has little to do with your concerns though.
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@Hans-van-de-Ven-MR-MRA said in Suggestion for announcements:
Why would you want to announce a formation point?
Why would you want to limit announcements to VIA points? VIA points are solely intended to be mandatory, no other features should be hung up on being VIA points.
@Con-Hennekens said in Suggestion for announcements:
@Hans-van-de-Ven-MR-MRA said in Suggestion for announcements:
Why would you want to announce a formation point?
Why would you want to limit announcements to VIA points? VIA points are solely intended to be mandatory, no other features should be hung up on being VIA points.
Correct and normal route points do not need to be announced for me. I also only selected the via points to be announced. Other points are there to shape the route and you can use 188 viapoints in the app.
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@Hans-van-de-Ven-MR-MRA, I think the keyword here is:
normal route points do not need to be announced for me.
I use announcements on shaping points A LOT, to point to interesting things along the road. It would be unwise to make them mandatory just to be able to get the note spoken. It would defy the purpose of auto-skipping.
I am just an enthusiastic MRA user, and hope you will be one too!
Most motorcycle problems are caused by the nut that connects the handlebar to the saddle.
Streetpilot 2610/Zumo 660/Zumo 395/ CAT S52 + MRA app -
@Hans-van-de-Ven-MR-MRA, I think the keyword here is:
normal route points do not need to be announced for me.
I use announcements on shaping points A LOT, to point to interesting things along the road. It would be unwise to make them mandatory just to be able to get the note spoken. It would defy the purpose of auto-skipping.
Then I would leave it as it is now. You can choose.
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@Hans-van-de-Ven-MR-MRA, I think the keyword here is:
normal route points do not need to be announced for me.
I use announcements on shaping points A LOT, to point to interesting things along the road. It would be unwise to make them mandatory just to be able to get the note spoken. It would defy the purpose of auto-skipping.
for me a conflict, use SPs for additional may important infos like highlights longside the street and these could be skipped.
The only big problem for me is the 2 Kilometer distance for POI annoncements with only one call which than may up to 2 minutes to reach the point and for the final destination you got 3 calls.
Peter
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for me a conflict, use SPs for additional may important infos like highlights longside the street and these could be skipped.
The only big problem for me is the 2 Kilometer distance for POI annoncements with only one call which than may up to 2 minutes to reach the point and for the final destination you got 3 calls.
@Con-Hennekens said in Suggestion for announcements:
@RetiredWingMan said in Suggestion for announcements:
I like being able to change the name of the waypoint. That way i can easily tell what the waypoint is when looking at the list of waypoints. I would prefer that a waypoint name that has been manually entered not be changed it I move the waypoint.
That is a great addition, thanks!
I think the system already does this,
in the web planner when you drag / move an existing point it will open a confirmation dialog box after the point is placed
if you select "Cancel" the new position is accepted but the new name is not, the old previously entered name is retained
in the mobile route planner it is a little bit more awkward / unintuitive
pick a point & select the move icon
after you have moved the point to the new location & click "move" to accept the new spot
the confirmation / point information panel appears
at the top you will see the new location / spot name
in the name box you will see the old previous name
simply place the cursor in the name box then type or add a space / backspace
just do something in the name box
when you now close the confirmation / point information panel the OLD name will be retainedby the way I am just extending / repeating what @Peter-Schiefer mentioned in an earlier post
& I appreciate nobody has taken the time to even consider or find fault with my suggestion, it is so simple, maybe its complicated
BlackView BV7100, Android 12, Offline mode with Offline Maps
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@Con-Hennekens said in Suggestion for announcements:
@RetiredWingMan said in Suggestion for announcements:
I like being able to change the name of the waypoint. That way i can easily tell what the waypoint is when looking at the list of waypoints. I would prefer that a waypoint name that has been manually entered not be changed it I move the waypoint.
That is a great addition, thanks!
I think the system already does this,
in the web planner when you drag / move an existing point it will open a confirmation dialog box after the point is placed
if you select "Cancel" the new position is accepted but the new name is not, the old previously entered name is retained
in the mobile route planner it is a little bit more awkward / unintuitive
pick a point & select the move icon
after you have moved the point to the new location & click "move" to accept the new spot
the confirmation / point information panel appears
at the top you will see the new location / spot name
in the name box you will see the old previous name
simply place the cursor in the name box then type or add a space / backspace
just do something in the name box
when you now close the confirmation / point information panel the OLD name will be retainedby the way I am just extending / repeating what @Peter-Schiefer mentioned in an earlier post
& I appreciate nobody has taken the time to even consider or find fault with my suggestion, it is so simple, maybe its complicated
@Brian-McG When I read all the reactions I get the idea that no one has read my proposal. Because everything that the various people want can be solved like this.
In my opinion, it is simple and straightforward to solve. Place all the text you want to be spoken in the notes field. Make sure you can check the box that you want to have that text spoken. If you do not check anything, it is just a standard note. Where you place this point in the route, it is spoken. If you want to report two kilometers before the gas station that there is a gas and coffee stop in two kilometers, then you place the message two kilometers before the gas station. You indicate the location of the gas station in your route in the usual way. This way, everyone is free to have something reported in distance or time and only an option needs to be created to have a text of your choice spoken. It does not matter whether you want to use a formation point or a via point for this. If there are people who still want to hear all the text or all the notes, you can give them a choice in Navigation settings/audio as it is by now.
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@Brian-McG When I read all the reactions I get the idea that no one has read my proposal. Because everything that the various people want can be solved like this.
In my opinion, it is simple and straightforward to solve. Place all the text you want to be spoken in the notes field. Make sure you can check the box that you want to have that text spoken. If you do not check anything, it is just a standard note. Where you place this point in the route, it is spoken. If you want to report two kilometers before the gas station that there is a gas and coffee stop in two kilometers, then you place the message two kilometers before the gas station. You indicate the location of the gas station in your route in the usual way. This way, everyone is free to have something reported in distance or time and only an option needs to be created to have a text of your choice spoken. It does not matter whether you want to use a formation point or a via point for this. If there are people who still want to hear all the text or all the notes, you can give them a choice in Navigation settings/audio as it is by now.
@Baltus
Baltus,
Long text in verbal announcement, be carefull, I do not know what the „Mother language“ for MRA text infos is, but I detect that with German text you got relativ often not understandable words.The internal engine for text to speach is not perfect. And a longer text will come in conflict with routing instructions.I propose not to use more then 5 to 8 words in one sentence.
Peter
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@Brian-McG When I read all the reactions I get the idea that no one has read my proposal. Because everything that the various people want can be solved like this.
In my opinion, it is simple and straightforward to solve. Place all the text you want to be spoken in the notes field. Make sure you can check the box that you want to have that text spoken. If you do not check anything, it is just a standard note. Where you place this point in the route, it is spoken. If you want to report two kilometers before the gas station that there is a gas and coffee stop in two kilometers, then you place the message two kilometers before the gas station. You indicate the location of the gas station in your route in the usual way. This way, everyone is free to have something reported in distance or time and only an option needs to be created to have a text of your choice spoken. It does not matter whether you want to use a formation point or a via point for this. If there are people who still want to hear all the text or all the notes, you can give them a choice in Navigation settings/audio as it is by now.
Hi @Baltus it is fun how we all like to write but not so much to read
& I have to say thank you for raising the original post that started all this discussion
First I would like to say there are two parts to the announcement question
- The What
- The When
I find conflating options/ scenarios to just lead to confusion & nobody really understanding or looking at the issues in their simplest form
My previous suggestion soley refers to "The What", this being what will be announced & what the structure or triggers are for controlling the announcement
& @Baltus I think we are saying the same thing regards the control, I think my suggestion does exactly the same as what you are saying, it just does not require any check boxas for "The When" I was trying to avoid this topic as it has been rehashed many times on here & any change regarding this always seems to be pushed down, I was hoping maybe to get the control / trigger side of things changed first then maybe with some luck "The When" but as everyone wants to join the issues.....
Again @Baltus I agree with you 100%, the whole 750m shape point, 2km Via points is daft & have said as much here
Having the announced point name / notes occur at the location the point is placed gives the user the most control.If the What was announced & the When was made & controlled as per my 2 suggestions I think there is enough flexibility in that setup that everyone could have what they want to hear, when they want to hear it
BlackView BV7100, Android 12, Offline mode with Offline Maps
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undefined Brian McG referenced this topic on
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@Con-Hennekens said in Suggestion for announcements:
@RetiredWingMan said in Suggestion for announcements:
I like being able to change the name of the waypoint. That way i can easily tell what the waypoint is when looking at the list of waypoints. I would prefer that a waypoint name that has been manually entered not be changed it I move the waypoint.
That is a great addition, thanks!
I think the system already does this,
in the web planner when you drag / move an existing point it will open a confirmation dialog box after the point is placed
if you select "Cancel" the new position is accepted but the new name is not, the old previously entered name is retained
in the mobile route planner it is a little bit more awkward / unintuitive
pick a point & select the move icon
after you have moved the point to the new location & click "move" to accept the new spot
the confirmation / point information panel appears
at the top you will see the new location / spot name
in the name box you will see the old previous name
simply place the cursor in the name box then type or add a space / backspace
just do something in the name box
when you now close the confirmation / point information panel the OLD name will be retainedby the way I am just extending / repeating what @Peter-Schiefer mentioned in an earlier post
& I appreciate nobody has taken the time to even consider or find fault with my suggestion, it is so simple, maybe its complicated
@Brian-McG said in Suggestion for announcements:
in the web planner when you drag / move an existing point it will open a confirmation dialog box after the point is placed
if you select "Cancel" the new position is accepted but the new name is not, the old previously entered name is retainedYes, it does that, but only when you have this option active: "Ask for route point name".
I never use that option, because I don't want pop-ups on ALL waypoints I place or move.
& I appreciate nobody has taken the time to even consider or find fault with my suggestion,
I read EVERYTHING
(well, almost!
)I think our approaches don't differ that much.
