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Google's location

Scheduled Pinned Locked Moved [Beta] Problems, Bugs and other Issues
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  • Con Hennekensundefined Con Hennekens

    @richtea999, the funny thing is that it is NOT so easily reproducible, since I have been using the app from the get go without ever enabling that stupid improvement function. At least we all agree that we don't want to use that 😉

    Another funny thing is that in our alpha group, we have one user that all of a sudden is also having this problem, he discovered it today. We have already been doing some testing, indoors/outdoors, with GPS fix/without GPS fix, checked the presence of a "real" compass (instead of fake direction data from the GPS stream). But have not found any plausible cause yet.

    Interesting is that Dev tells me that the message does NOT originate from the app, but from the OS. That does not make it easier...

    richtea999undefined Offline
    richtea999undefined Offline
    richtea999
    wrote on last edited by richtea999
    #29

    @Con-Hennekens said in Google's location:

    @richtea999, the funny thing is that it is NOT so easily reproducible

    It's 100% reproducible for me:

    • indoors and outdoors
    • on Android 8.0 & Android 12.0
    • 3 devices (OnePlus, Samsung, Ulefone)

    So I'm happy to test if you want to (temporarily) add me to your alpha testers list when you have a potential solution. Just give me a shout.

    [Edit: works OK on my Android 13. That's the only one.]

    Con Hennekensundefined 1 Reply Last reply
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    • richtea999undefined richtea999

      @Con-Hennekens said in Google's location:

      @richtea999, the funny thing is that it is NOT so easily reproducible

      It's 100% reproducible for me:

      • indoors and outdoors
      • on Android 8.0 & Android 12.0
      • 3 devices (OnePlus, Samsung, Ulefone)

      So I'm happy to test if you want to (temporarily) add me to your alpha testers list when you have a potential solution. Just give me a shout.

      [Edit: works OK on my Android 13. That's the only one.]

      Con Hennekensundefined Offline
      Con Hennekensundefined Offline
      Con Hennekens
      wrote on last edited by
      #30

      @richtea999, it is good to know that at least one of your devices handles this correctly. That rules out a lot of location based problems. When the dev team gets an idea of the cause of this strange issue, we will certainly let you know in this thread I think that can be tested excellently within the Beta program.

      Since the request popup to enable the "improved" Location Accuracy seems to originate from the OS instead of the app, it might well be an Android bug we are running into.

      I am just an enthusiastic MRA user, and hope you will be one too!

      Most motorcycle problems are caused by the nut that connects the handlebar to the saddle.

      Streetpilot 2610 / Zumo 660 / Zumo 395 / CAT S52 + MRA app

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      • Corjan Meijerinkundefined Offline
        Corjan Meijerinkundefined Offline
        Corjan Meijerink
        administrator
        wrote on last edited by
        #31

        We’ll definitely have a look again 🙂

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        • richtea999undefined richtea999

          @Con-Hennekens said in Google's location:

          @Whinging-Biker, Whatever you want... There is a developers saying "It is not a bug until the developer says it's a bug". There are simply too many users NOT having this problem, while the problem seems to center around your household. Me too are trying to establish it as a bug, but since you are not answering my questions, I will stop asking them.

          It's easily reproducible, Con. This is on Android 12, note, so it's nothing to do with old Android versions. I'd call it 'an unnecessary limitation verging on a bug'.

          Here's how to recreate it - just 2 steps really:

          1. Settings -> Location -> Google Location Accuracy -> Disable it
            loc1.jpg
            loc2.jpg

          2. Open MRA, and you immediately get offered two options. Pick 'No, thanks' and you're stuck in an endless loop, i.e. you can't use the app:
            loc3.jpg

          And see this video from earlier in the thread:
          http://www.poqit.com/MRA-loc.mp4

          I think the point Whinging-Biker is making (quite aggressively, unfortunately) is that a single Google sub-option shouldn't disable the app, especially when location is enabled, the popup suggests its merely a 'better experience', and the detailed option page (2nd image above) says GPS will still be used.

          I'm sure there's a work-around, but I can also imagine it's not the highest priority. One for the backlog!

          Whinging Bikerundefined Offline
          Whinging Bikerundefined Offline
          Whinging Biker
          wrote on last edited by
          #32

          @richtea999 said in Google's location:

          I think the point Whinging-Biker is making (quite aggressively, unfortunately) is that a single Google sub-option shouldn't disable the app, especially when location is enabled, the popup suggests its merely a 'better experience', and the detailed option page (2nd image above) says GPS will still be used.

          I apologise if I seemed 'quite aggressive'. Quite frustrated maybe.

          After comments such as
          "Android 7? In that case I'm not surprised something like this happens"
          and
          "you could try to revive your blackview"

          and then a claim that no one else has reported this problem when this person has been in conversation on this thread with 2 other people reporting this same problem more than 3 weeks before:
          30/6/23 - Con Hennekens
          @Whinging-Biker, Have you tried resetting your phone to factory defaults? I think it is a bit harsh to claim the issue as a bug since no- one else seems to have this problem. It likely is a phone or software issue on your device.

          	3/6/23 - @Con-Hennekens I have the same, if I try to turn off Google location services I get repeated messages to turn it on 			and the app won't work without it.
          	Samsung S22+ latest version of Android.
          
          	4/6/23 - It blocks me on Android 12 too so something is not quite right, but it's not the Android / API level.
          
          	5/6/23 - For Corjan, whenever you come back round to investigating:
          	Video of the app being locked out by having 'Google Location Accuracy' off which shows:
          
          	    repeated tapping of 'No, thanks' and it pops up again
          	    location is enabled when I pull down the Settings
          

          Also three other apps have been noted here as needing to code specifically to avoid this problem.

          In this thread it has shown up in Android 7, 8, 9, 10, 11 and 12 on Blackview, Huawei, OnePlus, Samsung and Ulefone. Surely it cannot be just a problem 'in my household'?

          All of the devices in my household have this same issue:

          Blackview Android 7
          Blackview Android 10 (x2)
          Huawei Android 9
          Samsung Android 11

          Con Hennekensundefined 1 Reply Last reply
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          • Whinging Bikerundefined Whinging Biker

            @richtea999 said in Google's location:

            I think the point Whinging-Biker is making (quite aggressively, unfortunately) is that a single Google sub-option shouldn't disable the app, especially when location is enabled, the popup suggests its merely a 'better experience', and the detailed option page (2nd image above) says GPS will still be used.

            I apologise if I seemed 'quite aggressive'. Quite frustrated maybe.

            After comments such as
            "Android 7? In that case I'm not surprised something like this happens"
            and
            "you could try to revive your blackview"

            and then a claim that no one else has reported this problem when this person has been in conversation on this thread with 2 other people reporting this same problem more than 3 weeks before:
            30/6/23 - Con Hennekens
            @Whinging-Biker, Have you tried resetting your phone to factory defaults? I think it is a bit harsh to claim the issue as a bug since no- one else seems to have this problem. It likely is a phone or software issue on your device.

            	3/6/23 - @Con-Hennekens I have the same, if I try to turn off Google location services I get repeated messages to turn it on 			and the app won't work without it.
            	Samsung S22+ latest version of Android.
            
            	4/6/23 - It blocks me on Android 12 too so something is not quite right, but it's not the Android / API level.
            
            	5/6/23 - For Corjan, whenever you come back round to investigating:
            	Video of the app being locked out by having 'Google Location Accuracy' off which shows:
            
            	    repeated tapping of 'No, thanks' and it pops up again
            	    location is enabled when I pull down the Settings
            

            Also three other apps have been noted here as needing to code specifically to avoid this problem.

            In this thread it has shown up in Android 7, 8, 9, 10, 11 and 12 on Blackview, Huawei, OnePlus, Samsung and Ulefone. Surely it cannot be just a problem 'in my household'?

            All of the devices in my household have this same issue:

            Blackview Android 7
            Blackview Android 10 (x2)
            Huawei Android 9
            Samsung Android 11

            Con Hennekensundefined Offline
            Con Hennekensundefined Offline
            Con Hennekens
            wrote on last edited by
            #33

            @Whinging-Biker, I think my statement about Android 7 is not so far fetched, since it has been abandoned by Google since 2020. What do you think you can expect from an app developer in such a case?

            @Con-Hennekens said in Google's location:

            Since the request popup to enable the "improved" Location Accuracy seems to originate from the OS instead of the app, it might well be an Android bug we are running into.

            The developer already claimed that the message you are getting does not originate from within the app.

            @richtea999 said in Google's location:

            I think the point Whinging-Biker is making // is that a single Google sub-option shouldn't disable the app.

            The app does not do that, the proof is in the pudding of the many users NOT having that problem.

            The dev team nevertheless promised to look into it.

            @Whinging-Biker said in Google's location:

            Surely it cannot be just a problem 'in my household'?

            I don't know. All the above shows "it surely cannot be the app". Truth is probably somewhere in the middle. But you obviously make a job of nailing "privacy" down on your phones. It could be an unpredicted outcome of a combination of a lot of privacy settings. Who can say. Android is a lot more complex than the app in that regard. I understand frustration to some extend, but there is no need for any angryness.

            I am just an enthusiastic MRA user, and hope you will be one too!

            Most motorcycle problems are caused by the nut that connects the handlebar to the saddle.

            Streetpilot 2610 / Zumo 660 / Zumo 395 / CAT S52 + MRA app

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            • flamingm0eundefined Offline
              flamingm0eundefined Offline
              flamingm0e
              wrote on last edited by
              #34

              After seeing all this back and forth, I just tried it myself.

              This is 100% the app.

              Changing absolutely nothing else but the Google location accuracy and launching MRA. I get the pop up. Samsung Galaxy S23+ on Android 13.

              Now, it's not necessarily the app's PROMPT, but it's caused, by likely something in the manifest file telling it to use Google Location API instead of the Android location api.

              The app is forcing a requirement of the Google Location API. Period.

              Con Hennekensundefined 1 Reply Last reply
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              • flamingm0eundefined flamingm0e

                After seeing all this back and forth, I just tried it myself.

                This is 100% the app.

                Changing absolutely nothing else but the Google location accuracy and launching MRA. I get the pop up. Samsung Galaxy S23+ on Android 13.

                Now, it's not necessarily the app's PROMPT, but it's caused, by likely something in the manifest file telling it to use Google Location API instead of the Android location api.

                The app is forcing a requirement of the Google Location API. Period.

                Con Hennekensundefined Offline
                Con Hennekensundefined Offline
                Con Hennekens
                wrote on last edited by
                #35

                @Matt-Flaming said in Google's location:

                The app is forcing a requirement of the Google Location API. Period.

                Some people seem very keen on throwing this over the fence of MRA, without considering the much more complex programming of Android compared to the MRA App, and the fact that most users do not suffer this problem.

                I am just an enthusiastic MRA user, and hope you will be one too!

                Most motorcycle problems are caused by the nut that connects the handlebar to the saddle.

                Streetpilot 2610 / Zumo 660 / Zumo 395 / CAT S52 + MRA app

                flamingm0eundefined 1 Reply Last reply
                0
                • Con Hennekensundefined Con Hennekens

                  @Matt-Flaming said in Google's location:

                  The app is forcing a requirement of the Google Location API. Period.

                  Some people seem very keen on throwing this over the fence of MRA, without considering the much more complex programming of Android compared to the MRA App, and the fact that most users do not suffer this problem.

                  flamingm0eundefined Offline
                  flamingm0eundefined Offline
                  flamingm0e
                  wrote on last edited by
                  #36

                  @Con-Hennekens said in Google's location:

                  the fact that most users do not suffer this problem

                  Because they aren't turning off Google location accuracy?

                  Please, for once, can we actually discuss the problem rather than defending everything MRA does?

                  Con Hennekensundefined 1 Reply Last reply
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                  • flamingm0eundefined flamingm0e

                    @Con-Hennekens said in Google's location:

                    the fact that most users do not suffer this problem

                    Because they aren't turning off Google location accuracy?

                    Please, for once, can we actually discuss the problem rather than defending everything MRA does?

                    Con Hennekensundefined Offline
                    Con Hennekensundefined Offline
                    Con Hennekens
                    wrote on last edited by Con Hennekens
                    #37

                    @Matt-Flaming said in Google's location:

                    Because they aren't turning off Google location accuracy?

                    I have three different devices ALL NOT having this problem, and I am smart enough to disable these dreadful "improvements" of the location services, thank you. This is what I am telling from the get go in this discussion. It is too easy to say it is "just an App problem".

                    But yes, I am pretty sure that MRA devs will have to invent a workaround to circumvent other parties enforcement of these location options. That's usually how it works with the Googles and the Apples in this world.

                    I think there is not much to discus any further.
                    MRA Devs promised to look into it. We will have to wait for that.

                    I am just an enthusiastic MRA user, and hope you will be one too!

                    Most motorcycle problems are caused by the nut that connects the handlebar to the saddle.

                    Streetpilot 2610 / Zumo 660 / Zumo 395 / CAT S52 + MRA app

                    1 Reply Last reply
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                    • richtea999undefined Offline
                      richtea999undefined Offline
                      richtea999
                      wrote on last edited by
                      #38

                      @Con-Hennekens said in Google's location:

                      Some people seem very keen on throwing this over the fence of MRA, without considering the much more complex programming of Android compared to the MRA App, and the fact that most users do not suffer this problem.

                      Other location-enabled apps still work with that Google Location Accuracy option disabled. MRA is the the odd one out, as far as I can tell from a quick test.

                      For example, switch it off (it's a system-wide option in Settings. -> Location -> Location Services in Android 13) and try Google Maps.
                      You get the same popup, but selecting 'No, thanks' doesn't lock you out of using Google Maps - you get an approximate location instead.

                      I struggled to find another map app that pops up the same warning, but these apps below managed to locate me within 25m or so (I'm indoors right now) with the option disabled:

                      • TomTom GO Ride
                      • Maps.me
                      • Kurviger
                      • OS Maps

                      On the positive side, we know MRA will be looking at it at some point.

                      RetiredWingManundefined Con Hennekensundefined 2 Replies Last reply
                      0
                      • richtea999undefined richtea999

                        @Con-Hennekens said in Google's location:

                        Some people seem very keen on throwing this over the fence of MRA, without considering the much more complex programming of Android compared to the MRA App, and the fact that most users do not suffer this problem.

                        Other location-enabled apps still work with that Google Location Accuracy option disabled. MRA is the the odd one out, as far as I can tell from a quick test.

                        For example, switch it off (it's a system-wide option in Settings. -> Location -> Location Services in Android 13) and try Google Maps.
                        You get the same popup, but selecting 'No, thanks' doesn't lock you out of using Google Maps - you get an approximate location instead.

                        I struggled to find another map app that pops up the same warning, but these apps below managed to locate me within 25m or so (I'm indoors right now) with the option disabled:

                        • TomTom GO Ride
                        • Maps.me
                        • Kurviger
                        • OS Maps

                        On the positive side, we know MRA will be looking at it at some point.

                        RetiredWingManundefined Offline
                        RetiredWingManundefined Offline
                        RetiredWingMan
                        wrote on last edited by
                        #39

                        @richtea999 if I turn off Google location, I constantly get the following error and I can't get rid of it.Screenshot_20230717-142720_Google Play services.jpg

                        2010 GL1800 Goldwing using Samsung Galaxy S20 5G Android 13.

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                        • richtea999undefined Offline
                          richtea999undefined Offline
                          richtea999
                          wrote on last edited by richtea999
                          #40

                          @Doug-Robinson
                          Exactly! That is the problem.

                          Press 'OK' and it will start working again (i.e. it enables the 'Google Location Accuracy' setting again)

                          Rather than lock you out, MRA should 'gracefully' continue as best it can without the additional Google setting, especially since GPS is enabled and you'll still get a high accuracy location fix in most circumstances.

                          (Enabling Google Location Accuracy will give better results indoors, and where satellite visibilty is poor, such as high-rise city streets with very tall buildings all around you, but at a cost of data collection by Google, which some folks would prefer not to allow.)

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                          • richtea999undefined richtea999

                            @Con-Hennekens said in Google's location:

                            Some people seem very keen on throwing this over the fence of MRA, without considering the much more complex programming of Android compared to the MRA App, and the fact that most users do not suffer this problem.

                            Other location-enabled apps still work with that Google Location Accuracy option disabled. MRA is the the odd one out, as far as I can tell from a quick test.

                            For example, switch it off (it's a system-wide option in Settings. -> Location -> Location Services in Android 13) and try Google Maps.
                            You get the same popup, but selecting 'No, thanks' doesn't lock you out of using Google Maps - you get an approximate location instead.

                            I struggled to find another map app that pops up the same warning, but these apps below managed to locate me within 25m or so (I'm indoors right now) with the option disabled:

                            • TomTom GO Ride
                            • Maps.me
                            • Kurviger
                            • OS Maps

                            On the positive side, we know MRA will be looking at it at some point.

                            Con Hennekensundefined Offline
                            Con Hennekensundefined Offline
                            Con Hennekens
                            wrote on last edited by
                            #41

                            @richtea999 said in Google's location:

                            MRA is the the odd one out

                            Yes I know it is, but that does not mean the error lies within the MRA app. I am sure no one at MRA thought: "let's force the location improvements". It is a bit like the "homograph" discussion elsewhere in this forum. That is a proven bug in IOS. The fact that other apps found a workaround for it does not change that. One way or another, I hope the MRA Dev team will find a workaround for this one too. Because I too are certainly NOT in favor of the location accuracy nonsense.

                            I am beginning to think these kind of things are flutter related. The platform independent way of developing leaves a lot of tasks to the OS. That's easy in terms of coding, but gives more chance of undesired side effects, and less handles for workarounds or deploying alternative methods.

                            @richtea999 said in Google's location:

                            Enabling Google Location Accuracy will give better results indoors, and where satellite visibilty is poor, such as high-rise city streets with very tall buildings all around you, but at a cost of data collection by Google

                            I seriously doubt accuracy benefits at all. You add a less accurate method to enlarge accuracy? Yes indoors maybe...

                            And for the data collection by Google: better not use smartphones at all. And no, Apple does not help. They will just skip the toggle for such a function. And both will collect data, even with the slider disabled...

                            I am just an enthusiastic MRA user, and hope you will be one too!

                            Most motorcycle problems are caused by the nut that connects the handlebar to the saddle.

                            Streetpilot 2610 / Zumo 660 / Zumo 395 / CAT S52 + MRA app

                            flamingm0eundefined 1 Reply Last reply
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                            • Con Hennekensundefined Con Hennekens

                              @richtea999 said in Google's location:

                              MRA is the the odd one out

                              Yes I know it is, but that does not mean the error lies within the MRA app. I am sure no one at MRA thought: "let's force the location improvements". It is a bit like the "homograph" discussion elsewhere in this forum. That is a proven bug in IOS. The fact that other apps found a workaround for it does not change that. One way or another, I hope the MRA Dev team will find a workaround for this one too. Because I too are certainly NOT in favor of the location accuracy nonsense.

                              I am beginning to think these kind of things are flutter related. The platform independent way of developing leaves a lot of tasks to the OS. That's easy in terms of coding, but gives more chance of undesired side effects, and less handles for workarounds or deploying alternative methods.

                              @richtea999 said in Google's location:

                              Enabling Google Location Accuracy will give better results indoors, and where satellite visibilty is poor, such as high-rise city streets with very tall buildings all around you, but at a cost of data collection by Google

                              I seriously doubt accuracy benefits at all. You add a less accurate method to enlarge accuracy? Yes indoors maybe...

                              And for the data collection by Google: better not use smartphones at all. And no, Apple does not help. They will just skip the toggle for such a function. And both will collect data, even with the slider disabled...

                              flamingm0eundefined Offline
                              flamingm0eundefined Offline
                              flamingm0e
                              wrote on last edited by
                              #42

                              @Con-Hennekens said in Google's location:

                              but that does not mean the error lies within the MRA app

                              MRA is telling the OS to use that API and not the Android Location API.

                              It's MRA. Stop trying to defend it.

                              @Con-Hennekens said in Google's location:

                              I am sure no one at MRA thought: "let's force the location improvements".

                              Nobody here thinks that. It's a BUG, but it is indeed MRA.

                              Please. For the love of Pete, stop trying to defend MRA so hard. Some of us have spent time developing on Android. We're not morons.

                              Con Hennekensundefined 1 Reply Last reply
                              -1
                              • flamingm0eundefined flamingm0e

                                @Con-Hennekens said in Google's location:

                                but that does not mean the error lies within the MRA app

                                MRA is telling the OS to use that API and not the Android Location API.

                                It's MRA. Stop trying to defend it.

                                @Con-Hennekens said in Google's location:

                                I am sure no one at MRA thought: "let's force the location improvements".

                                Nobody here thinks that. It's a BUG, but it is indeed MRA.

                                Please. For the love of Pete, stop trying to defend MRA so hard. Some of us have spent time developing on Android. We're not morons.

                                Con Hennekensundefined Offline
                                Con Hennekensundefined Offline
                                Con Hennekens
                                wrote on last edited by
                                #43

                                @Matt-Flaming said in Google's location:

                                MRA is telling the OS to use that API and not the Android Location API.

                                I am no developer, so I am not afraid to admit others have more insight in this. But what I am telling is that for many people, including myself, the disabling of location accuracy DOES NOT pose that error message. So the problem is a little more complex than just calling one or the other API. I am not a moron either, thank you...

                                I am just an enthusiastic MRA user, and hope you will be one too!

                                Most motorcycle problems are caused by the nut that connects the handlebar to the saddle.

                                Streetpilot 2610 / Zumo 660 / Zumo 395 / CAT S52 + MRA app

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                                • flamingm0eundefined Offline
                                  flamingm0eundefined Offline
                                  flamingm0e
                                  wrote on last edited by
                                  #44

                                  I just tried this with 3 different devices. Android 9, 10, 13. All exhibit the same exact behavior. That's not a coincidence, and it's not that complex.

                                  I guess that I should go back to just reading the forums and not interacting with the community, because it's obvious that the people that act like MRA can do no wrong don't really care about involvement with people that may have differing ideas than theirs. Enjoy your echo chamber.

                                  1 Reply Last reply
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                                  • richtea999undefined Offline
                                    richtea999undefined Offline
                                    richtea999
                                    wrote on last edited by richtea999
                                    #45

                                    @Corjan-Meijerink said [12 days ago] in Google's location:

                                    We’ll definitely have a look again 🙂

                                    There's nothing else to be said.
                                    Somebody please lock the thread. 😬

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                                    • Corjan Meijerinkundefined Corjan Meijerink locked this topic on
                                    • Corjan Meijerinkundefined Corjan Meijerink unlocked this topic on
                                    • Corjan Meijerinkundefined Offline
                                      Corjan Meijerinkundefined Offline
                                      Corjan Meijerink
                                      administrator
                                      wrote on last edited by
                                      #46

                                      @Matt-Flaming @Whinging-Biker I've worked on a solution for this issue which will be available in the next Beta & release (4.0.3).

                                      More details about this update will be announced tomorrow 😃 🎉

                                      flamingm0eundefined 1 Reply Last reply
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                                      • Corjan Meijerinkundefined Corjan Meijerink

                                        @Matt-Flaming @Whinging-Biker I've worked on a solution for this issue which will be available in the next Beta & release (4.0.3).

                                        More details about this update will be announced tomorrow 😃 🎉

                                        flamingm0eundefined Offline
                                        flamingm0eundefined Offline
                                        flamingm0e
                                        wrote on last edited by
                                        #47

                                        @Corjan-Meijerink I appreciate the effort, but I'm not that interested in any of this any more. I don't think the harassing chat message I received after my previous comment, was warranted.

                                        Corjan Meijerinkundefined 1 Reply Last reply
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                                        • flamingm0eundefined flamingm0e

                                          @Corjan-Meijerink I appreciate the effort, but I'm not that interested in any of this any more. I don't think the harassing chat message I received after my previous comment, was warranted.

                                          Corjan Meijerinkundefined Offline
                                          Corjan Meijerinkundefined Offline
                                          Corjan Meijerink
                                          administrator
                                          wrote on last edited by
                                          #48

                                          @Matt-Flaming to be brutally honest, your attitude at certain points in time (over a longer history than the one you and me have since the Next development) did not contribute to your general reputation.

                                          The forum is public, with lots of different opinions and we all tend to help each other. Yet, some people annoy the community more than others. Shake it off dude.

                                          I appreciate all feedback and do tend to pay attention to everything, but I can only work as fast as I do (which is pretty damn fast). So ignore others that annoy and don’t make these comments in my direction. I have no knowledge about private messages sent to you, keep me out of it.

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                                            Hubert Thoringundefined
                                            Hubert Thoring
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                                          • Knipperend scherm tijdens navigeren
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                                            Paul e9
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                                            102

                                          • Route app werkt helaas nog niet hoe ik het graag zou zien.
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                                          • Voorlopen routelijn op aanwijzer.
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